Cheating is back?

[Henry of Grosmont]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?801034-The-cheats-are-back&p=18048919#post18048919
Haoko told me he has it recorded.

[Aeronwen]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?801034-The-cheats-are-back&p=18048919#post18048919
Haoko told me he has it recorded.

if he does it would really help if he sent the recording direct to EAC and didn't make it public.

[Henry of Grosmont]

Too late, I guess. Besides, too many people encountered him in the past two days. User tried to record him as well, after he showed up on the server. I, honestly, didn't want to believe until I saw it with my own eyes. Frustrating.

Btw, I think that keeping quiet and not addressing the existing cheating in roses (after EAC) made this possible. I spoke, quietly, to both Moo and EAC guy about it and nothing happened.

[Aeronwen]

what continued cheating?

Its a pro and con situation, the more you advertise that there are cheats the more players are going to seek them out and use them.  if we can get this dealt with before it becomes a big problem that is the best thing for the game.

[Henry of Grosmont]

what continued cheating?

There were few people that continued their cheating like nothing happened. In fact, even before EAC, it was obvious that they weren't usint the cheat engine but something else. And it was reported to PDX and EAC in private.

Its a pro and con situation, the more you advertise that there are cheats the more players are going to seek them out and use them.  if we can get this dealt with before it becomes a big problem that is the best thing for the game.

Well, it hasn't been dealt with after they got PMs. So...
Plus, several of known hackers re-appeared at the same time, meaning that they were seeking those without any encouragement.

[Aeronwen]

what continued cheating?

There were few people that continued their cheating like nothing happened. In fact, even before EAC, it was obvious that they weren't usint the cheat engine but something else. And it was reported to PDX and EAC in private.

hmm well obviously people dealing with cheats don't want to talk too much about the why some cheats are more difficult to deal with, but I haven't seen any proof of wrongdoing since EAC was implemented (that I remember).  Did you report it to EAC? if not how do you know it was reported?

Its a pro and con situation, the more you advertise that there are cheats the more players are going to seek them out and use them.  if we can get this dealt with before it becomes a big problem that is the best thing for the game.

Well, it hasn't been dealt with after they got PMs. So...
Plus, several of known hackers re-appeared at the same time, meaning that they were seeking those without any encouragement.

well if it has not been dealt with yet it is because EAC do not have enough information yet.  Advertising the cheat will not help that situation.  while its true that people who like to  cheat anyway will do so - it is also true, and we saw this very clearly with cheat engine in Roses, that when you make it widely known that people are cheating more players seek out the cheat.

[Henry of Grosmont]

hmm well obviously people dealing with cheats don't want to talk too much about the why some cheats are more difficult to deal with, but I haven't seen any proof of wrongdoing since EAC was implemented (that I remember).  Did you report it to EAC? if not how do you know it was reported?

I did. After talking to Moo, I wrote to the EAC member on plaza. If I recall it right, your presence in roses was, unfortunately, very limited until recently. Several well know players (who spend hours every day playing the game) are sure about the fact that cheating was still there but very limited and that's why I did it in private.

well if it has not been dealt with yet it is because EAC do not have enough information yet.  Advertising the cheat will not help that situation.  while its true that people who like to  cheat anyway will do so - it is also true, and we saw this very clearly with cheat engine in Roses, that when you make it widely known that people are cheating more players seek out the cheat.

But if it's there and nothing has been done, what's left?

[Aeronwen]

hmm well obviously people dealing with cheats don't want to talk too much about the why some cheats are more difficult to deal with, but I haven't seen any proof of wrongdoing since EAC was implemented (that I remember).  Did you report it to EAC? if not how do you know it was reported?

I did. After talking to Moo, I wrote to the EAC member on plaza. If I recall it right, your presence in roses was, unfortunately, very limited until recently. Several well know players (who spend hours every day playing the game) are sure about the fact that cheating was still there but very limited and that's why I did it in private.

well if it has not been dealt with yet it is because EAC do not have enough information yet.  Advertising the cheat will not help that situation.  while its true that people who like to  cheat anyway will do so - it is also true, and we saw this very clearly with cheat engine in Roses, that when you make it widely known that people are cheating more players seek out the cheat.

But if it's there and nothing has been done, what's left?

Yeah you are right my time in roses has been limited lately and I am also not as certain as some that when i see something odd it is cheating.  which is why we always did ask other members to check it out.

If EAC cant do anything yet about this cheat publicising it will not help them.  Publicising a cheat has been shown to increase, not decrease, the numbers of cheaters - so why would you do it?  what is it that you think will be made better by publicising it?

With the future of Roses still uncertain talking down the game or increasing the number of cheaters may be the catalyst that causes PDX to abandon the game.

[Henry of Grosmont]

Yeah you are right my time in roses has been limited lately and I am also not as certain as some that when i see something odd it is cheating.  which is why we always did ask other members to check it out.

This was the same thing with the lag. We didn't voice our concern before we were absolutely sure. Right now, people don't know if the lag was caused by the cheating (something similar happened prior EAC).

If EAC cant do anything yet about this cheat publicising it will not help them.  Publicising a cheat has been shown to increase, not decrease, the numbers of cheaters - so why would you do it?  what is it that you think will be made better by publicising it?

Then they're not good at their job. Plain and simple. Yeah, it could make it better. To start with, it could prompt PDX to remove the "free to play" tag as it has proven to be a major blunder. That could reduce the number of cheaters dramatically. The ones who are known would get banned and unable to create a new account. Plan and simple.

With the future of Roses still uncertain talking down the game or increasing the number of cheaters may be the catalyst that causes PDX to abandon the game.

I don't understand. Am I supposed to suffer and hope that PDX did not abandon the game and might, one day in the future, present us with the announcement?

[Aeronwen]

well I notified Moo - he would like to see a video - he cant do anything without.

[Fat Walrus?]

there are a lot of players(including myself) who started playing roses because it was F2P.... i hope that PDX dosent follow ur advice henry 

[Henry of Grosmont]

well I notified Moo - he would like to see a video - he cant do anything without.

Sent him PM and will try to record the speedhacker.

@Walrus
times are different. PDX gave up on cheaters because they just could open a new account and continue as if nothing happened. Let's see them pay to do that. Plus, these days, there are always sales where you can buy roses for $4-5 (sometimes including Warband and more). So, I think it's worth it.

[Greedy Sheedy]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?801034-The-cheats-are-back&p=18048919#post18048919
Haoko told me he has it recorded.

Great so I can finally come back?!

Its a pro and con situation, the more you advertise that there are cheats the more players are going to seek them out and use them. 

On a more serious not I totally agree with this. It is obviously too tempting to vent your anger to other legitimate players using the PDX forums but the more people hear the more it will sink down through players and eventually we'll be completely overrun with them again. So just a few now whilst it gets resolved is better than having 3 or 4 in each server.

The reason I haven't played the game in so long was because just before AC came out it got to the point where every server had a super fast hacker destroying it and it just got too much. I hope that doesn't happen again.

[Henry of Grosmont]

Great so I can finally come back?!

Ye, your time has come

On a more serious not I totally agree with this. It is obviously too tempting to vent your anger to other legitimate players using the PDX forums but the more people hear the more it will sink down through players and eventually we'll be completely overrun with them again. So just a few now whilst it gets resolved is better than having 3 or 4 in each server.

The reason I haven't played the game in so long was because just before AC came out it got to the point where every server had a super fast hacker destroying it and it just got too much. I hope that doesn't happen again.

It's all good if it's kept quiet, reported to the devs and they're aware and taking care of it. Which wasn't the case here.

Edit.
Look, I would love if it was kept under control and quietly reported and was dealt with. Unfortunately, PDX is at fault here too, disregarding previous PMs (form several players, as far as I know) about cheaters (very, very few) still bypassing anti-cheat. I'm in touch with Moo now and hopefully EAC will take care of it quickly.

[Ignoble user]

I will delete the thread on Pdx, if it will help or is possible.

I noticed the old cheaters start to come back a week or so ago. At first it was just one, I guess he/she was testing the cheat. Then slowly I saw more of the known cheats reappear.  I did watch them and could see no obvious sign of them cheating, until Sunday. I had heard some say it had started again but until Sunday I had not physically seen it.

I have tried recording it but I struggle to stay close/alive long enough to be able to so.

My post on Pdx was in hindsight probably a poor judgement/knee jerk reaction. 

On a plus note, I have only seen one of the cheats (that I keep my eye on) today and I could see no noticable cheating. I followed them for over an hour and on several servers.